Disenfranchise?
When Senator Clinton began falling behind in votes, she became determined the primary votes in Florida and Michigan should count. Her reasoning was that she felt these two states should not be disenfranchised.
Now Senator Clinton sounds as though she is willing to take this to the convention and perhaps rely on the super delegates to give her the nomination.
Seems to me allowing the decision to be made for the Democratic nominee, relying solely on the votes of the super delegates, might well disenfranchise a lot more states than just Florida and Michigan. Is Senator Clinton worried about that?
Now Senator Clinton sounds as though she is willing to take this to the convention and perhaps rely on the super delegates to give her the nomination.
Seems to me allowing the decision to be made for the Democratic nominee, relying solely on the votes of the super delegates, might well disenfranchise a lot more states than just Florida and Michigan. Is Senator Clinton worried about that?
posted by pissed off patricia at 1:49 AM
26 Comments:
You know, as much as I remain somewhat tepid on Obama, my feelings are clear about Clinton.
When will she stop? The campaign has such an air of desperation and anger to it; entitlement.
It is really awful. I heard Bill Clinton, whom I have always loved, at a campaign rally and his screechy tone really turned me off.
This must stop.
I'm worried about all this crap leading to President McCain.
this has to end. i've lost almost all respect for either clinton and i used to be a big fan of both.
and the thought of mccain as prez scares the hell out of me!
Apparently not. But in the rarified air that she's been breathing for so long, consistency isn't something she feels obliged to provide. Whether it's telling tall tales about Bosnia, or claiming to be named after an explorer whose conquests occurred after her birth, or her on/off support of NAFTA, the pattern is clear. She'll say whatever is expedient, regardless of its' truth or consistency if it suits her current objective. Given the short attention span of the public and the mainstream media, seldom is she held accountable. I share Randals' concerns about the backlash of this.
She has a set agenda and the blinders are on. Her overly selfish endeavor is going to ruin the convention. She squandered her front-runner status MONTHS before the "lie" and now she's a fish out of water gasping and flopping around in an embarrassing bid to remain relevant.
If McCain wins the gig, it's Hillary's fault and she should always be reminded of it. Always.
There is still time for this to get fixed before the convention. Hillary and her campaign staff sincerely believe that if Obama is nominated the GOP will trash him in the general and the only chance the Dems have is with HRC. Right or wrong we need to let this play out.
take heart brave souls- al gore is rumoured to be thinking independent candidate for president with bloomberg as his mate. we'll see. the thing that irks me- those two states deliberately disenfranchised themselves- for whatever reasons. at least one had a rethug state government. why make rules if you are not going to stick with them? they chose to move the primary up- folks knew that last year. i would have thought that the democratic party heads would have worked around that. which they probably did. clinton is the one who is desperate. i won't even get started.
no.
i think you might see some real upheaval by we the people, if it all comes down to super delegates. a general strike, perhaps?
Hillary's ego is in her way...she's tripping all over it. Now, I know politicans need big egos. but I wish she would set it aside for the good of the democratic party, and ultimately the country. The people really have spoken. Duh.
I've been trying not to jump in on this stuff because I'm sympathetic to some Clinton supporters but not her candidacy, but I would like to say it bothers me when Clinton talks about voting rights and disenfranchisement.
I don't remember the Clintons being that concerned in 1999 with the Bush shenanigans going on in Florida that stopped the counting of votes and effectively robbed Al Gore of the white house. Not to mention the disenfranchising of 51 MILLION Americans who voted for Gore.
They're selective about the fights they pick. Fair enough since they're politicians. But let's not pretend they're suddenly on the side of angels out of the goodness of their hearts.
Hillary is worried about what is best for Hillary and her Giant Enormous Ego.
She's the new Ralph Nadir.
I was worried about this some time ago and it seems right now that all of my fears are coming true. The worst that could happen is that John McCain ends up being President, but the "best" is almost as bad if the democrats in general become disenfranchised. It's just not a good thing.
No. No. No. If McCain is elected in November, it will not be Hillary's fault. Stop with this astral projection of blame bullshit (there are still Democrats blaming Nader for Bush in 2000)! If McCain is elected, it will be the "fault" of the American people...your fellow citizenz (sic)...your countrymen! Get used to the idea that McCain is what people want and will elect. Your fellow Americans are the problem...remember that at all times.
Should'nt the voters in Florida and Michigan have thier voices heard? Or should only Obama supporters be heard?
Well put in that last paragraph, POP. Hillary's interview with NPR on 3/13 really disappointed me. Her positions and rhetoric are those of a hack. She's arguing for personal advantage, and disingenuously, not for fairness.
Hillary's not worried. She will do whatever it takes to play ball. That worries me.
Also, if Michigan & Florida delegates do get seated, has anyone realized that this will increase the number of delegates needed to secure nomination? The rules are 50% + 1. Add more delegates, and the magic number of 2,025 goes up accordingly. Unless the DNC has subverted that rule, Hillary cannot prevail even WITH that strategy. The numbers just aren't there.
No President McCain, please.
They don't care about disenfranchising the voter only using them. Hillary and Bill have sickened me with their mis performance during this. They will take this to the convention, party and the future of America be damned. They only care about themselves and winning.
Can you imagine having the ill fortune of being her VP with Bill around? It would be insufferable!
It makes bowling for the presidency seem like not such a terrible idea. McCain would not be a good bowler.
the fact that obama was not a good bowler thrilled me! maybe he was busy learning other (more cerebral) things.
The mere thought of another 4, possibly 8 years of GOP run kicks my gag reflex into high gear. The American people absolutely cannot be that stupid. But then I look at Bush and am reminded that indeed some are.
The whole disenfranchisement thing is a crock - Hillary wouldn't be complaining if the two states in question had voted for Obama over her. And the states did it to themselves; they were told what would happen if they moved their primaries up and they did it anyway. That said, I don't see why the DNC cared when they held their primaries, but that's another story.
Betmo, I hope the rumor about Gore/Bloomberg is wrong. If they run as independents that would ensure McCain would win. Talk about splitting the Democratic party!
she should be worried about that
I don't see why Gore would want a cabinet position, when he can come in as a consultant instead and do much good. It'd also be good to get in some new blood.
And Bloomberg is a joke. His actual positions are pretty firmly conservative, even if he's amiable, but then the press didn't care about Reagan's far right policies because he was such a nice guy (see also Bush and McCain). Does anybody really want Bloomberg, aside from dolts like Broder, Richard Cohen, Joe Klein, and... Bloomberg?
What Hillary Clinton says is good for the country seems to change with the shifting set of circumstances that best favor her position.
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